re: Spruce spars source ?

hi
you could ring Kingsley Farrington in Norfolk UK he may be able to help,
his boat builder makes masts and spars from spruce infact i was watching him
during the summer make a mast for the Brown boats they make, It took about 2
weeks from planks to mast so I would think they are very expencive.

Kingsley may be listed under boat transportation or boat building he does
both and he is based in Norwich Uk the suberb is called Trowse. Try Yell.com
to search for him.

fragged


"Courtney Thomas" <ccthomas DeleteThis @joimail.com> wrote in message
news:40547917.8050307@joimail.com...
 > Any publication suggestions regarding construction of same would also be
 > appreciated.
 >
 > Thank you.
 > --
 > Courtney Thomas
 > s/v Mutiny
 > lying Oriental, NC
 > WDB5619
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:24:07 -0500, Courtney Thomas
<ccthomas.RemoveThis@joimail.com> wrote:

 >Any publication suggestions regarding construction of same would also be
 >appreciated.
 >
 >Thank you.

Aircraft Spruce sells prime sitka spruce spar stock, if you can handle
the price.
Corona, Ca 1-800 824-1930
Griffin, Ga 1-800 831-2949

Examples: 1.5 inch X 4 inch $10.40 per lineal foot plus 15% for
lengths over 12 ft. (oldish catalog prices !!)
You could route the two halves, and glue and clamp.

But as you may know, spruce is not the hardyest, the lightest, or the
strongest wood; far from it.

If you can handle the top weight, there are stronger, cheaper
whitewoods. Spruce is desired for its superior strength to weight.
That's all. You would not be cast down in Hell if you chose
cleargrain builders' studs to laminate, for example.
Cheaper by far.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

there's a book by Edwin Monk, "How to build a boat", or a title to
that effect, with a short section describing different kinds of solid
and hollow masts, and the procedure to build and rig them, including
plans for cheap mast clamps and drawings on how to scarf planks together
to glue up the mast. it also gives general formulas for the proportions
of various spars. i'll check at home and post the complete reference.

roberto
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

Sounds like a good source of mast making information.

My biggest problem was always the clamping requirements.

Second was building a long straight bench to build the mast on.. Not
something that you can do on a couple saw horses.

Once I had the bench built, I then built about 100 square clamp frames and
about 500 wedges. All of this generally ends up in a mass production
operation..

As a military person, most of the time I was building boats and masts, each
new project found me in a new location and of course the need to build
everything from scratch again.

I don't think I would build another mast, with the availability of good used
aluminum mast and the light weight advantages they afford.

I'd leave the wood mast to the traditional boats where alum. would be an eye
sour.

Steve
s/v Good Intentions
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

For spars and spar construction, see chapter 12 in
"Modern Boat Building" by Edwin Monk, 1973 (out of print, but my
local public library has it).
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

Thank you.

I've now ordered it.

Courtney


BIANCO ROBERTO wrote:

 > For spars and spar construction, see chapter 12 in
 > "Modern Boat Building" by Edwin Monk, 1973 (out of print, but my
 > local public library has it).
 >


--
Courtney Thomas
s/v Mutiny
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

Look at 'Practical Yacht Joinery" by Fred Bingham gives instructions on building
a wooden mast. Also if using clear Douglas Fir (the actual Douglas Fir not the
substitutes that many suppliers try to sell) you can reduce skantling by 10% for
a similar strength to weight ratio.

JJ

On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 00:47:17 GMT, Brian Whatcott <betwys1.DeleteThis@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

 >On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:24:07 -0500, Courtney Thomas
 ><ccthomas.DeleteThis@joimail.com> wrote:
 >
  >>Any publication suggestions regarding construction of same would also be
  >>appreciated.
  >>
  >>Thank you.
 >
 >Aircraft Spruce sells prime sitka spruce spar stock, if you can handle
 >the price.
 > Corona, Ca 1-800 824-1930
 > Griffin, Ga 1-800 831-2949
 >
 >Examples: 1.5 inch X 4 inch $10.40 per lineal foot plus 15% for
 >lengths over 12 ft. (oldish catalog prices !!)
 >You could route the two halves, and glue and clamp.
 >
 >But as you may know, spruce is not the hardyest, the lightest, or the
 >strongest wood; far from it.
 >
 >If you can handle the top weight, there are stronger, cheaper
 >whitewoods. Spruce is desired for its superior strength to weight.
 >That's all. You would not be cast down in Hell if you chose
 >cleargrain builders' studs to laminate, for example.
 > Cheaper by far.
 >
 >Brian Whatcott Altus OK

James Johnson
remove the "dot" from after sail in email address to reply<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

James Johnson <saildot.maryland RemoveThis @verizon.net> wrote in message news:<sf1v50pm63p3sgjv8tu17m3cjm5i7ju3me RemoveThis @4ax.com>...
 > Look at 'Practical Yacht Joinery" by Fred Bingham gives instructions on building
 > a wooden mast. Also if using clear Douglas Fir (the actual Douglas Fir not the
 > substitutes that many suppliers try to sell) you can reduce skantling by 10% for
 > a similar strength to weight ratio.
 >
 > JJ

I wish I knew where to find the engineered lumber that was
developed a few years ago. It's the lumber equivalent of plywood or
OSB or particle board. The wood is cut into long, very thin and narrow
strips (like string), laid in a mold with some resin, and compressed.
The result is a board with very straight grain, no knots or other
flaws, really consistent. A bit heavier than the lumber made from the
same wood, but just as strong or stronger. Chief drawback, as I
understand it, is the tendency to fail very suddenly when
overstressed; no warning noises.
This stuff would make dandy spars for boats, and for aircraft
wings, too. Shrinkage would be much less of a problem. The only thing
I've seen that's anywhere close is the stuff used for top and bottom
caps on engineered floor joists. Looks like plywood with the grain all
running longitudinally.

Dan

Dan<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

On 23 Mar 2004 16:41:38 -0800, Dan_Thomas_nospam.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Dan
Thomas) wrote:


 > I wish I knew where to find the engineered lumber that was
 >developed a few years ago. It's the lumber equivalent of plywood or
 >OSB or particle board. The wood is cut into long, very thin and narrow
 >strips (like string), laid in a mold with some resin, and compressed.

LVL (laminated veneer lumber)? See
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.apawood.org/level_b.cfm?content=prd_lvl_main." target="_blank">http://www.apawood.org/level_b.cfm?content=prd_lvl_main.</a> The
Georgia-Pacific version of the product, including usage guidelines,
can be found at
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.gp.com/build/product.aspx?pname=G-P+Lam%c2%ae+LVL&pid=1730&hierarchy=." target="_blank">http://www.gp.com/build/product.aspx?pname=G-P+Lam%c2%ae+LVL&pid=1730&...rarchy=</a>

- Rick Tyler

--
"Ignorant voracity -- a wingless vulture -- can soar only into the
depths of ignominy." Patrick O'Brian<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

Good points. I had forgotten about Binghams book. Been on my book self but
haven't looked at it for years.. Never cared for his coverage on cabinet
work.. I still prefer Bruce Binghams books and designs.

Of the 6 wood masts I have built, 3 were with douglas fir.. Good fir is
become almost as hard to find as Sitka Spruce. Some of the fine mill work is
good quality fir, however the moisture content is very low.. I have a pocket
moisture meter and when I tested some mill wook lumber it was 8% or lower.

One of the best mast I built was of Flight Deck Fir.. This was some old
surplus stock that I purchased from the Navy supply system while stationed
over seas. This douglas fir and very straight vertical grain.. The
Mil.Spec. on this stuff was very stingent. I was also able to get it in 20ft
lengths.

Fortunately I was building a box section mast and therefore able to reduce
the thickness to make up for the extra weight without effecting the required
strength and outside dimensions.

Also, being box section, there was very little hand shaping or planning..

However, as I have done previously, for a solid spare there is nothing like
Sitka Spruce, IMHO.

Steve
s/v Good Intentions
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ? 

The Shipyards (and maybe other) use this form of lumber for scaffold planks.
Full 2"X12" (heavy as hell).

I found some in scap surplus since OSHA only allows them in service so long
(same with fir planks). I tried cutting some deck beams out of these but
found that the veneers are of a low quality and the laminating process is
pretty sloppy.. Once I ripped a plank to expose the unweather edge, I could
see many voids (all the they small,1/16" to 1/8"). Also where one veneer
would stop (about every 8")and the next begins, they would overlap rather
than butt, causing the veneers above and below to compress and deform. I
don't know how this effects strength, but it wasn't a pretty sight.

As it turned out, 2" wasn't thick enough for the regular deck beams and I
only made one which is sistered with a engine room bulkhead (where I don't
have to look at it).

For mast building, IMHO, the laminate voids would allow water entry and the
overlaping veneers would have unpredictable effect on the masts performance.
 >> Stay informed about: re: Spruce spars source ?