2 stroke / 4 stroke advice

"Garland Gray II" <ggray.TakeThisOut@nospam.com> wrote in
news:YK59h.114$Hj4.39@newsfe17.lga:

> 4 strokes are great for a lot of reasons, but if fuel quality is
> questionable, they can be more trouble than 2 strokes. I've had fuel
> problems with a 9.9 Yamaha 4 stroke, and an ob mechanic said water or
> trash caused more problems w/4 strokes because of the smaller jets.
>
>

Also, if you look back at the "good ol' days", remember when
"winterizing" the old 2-stroker meant hauling it up the dock and putting
it in the garage until spring? When you took it out in spring, just as
greasy as you put it away, it wasn't all rusted up coated with oil like
it always was. You poured PREMIX gas into it and drove away.

We have a Nissan 8hp 4-stroker for a Foldabote 12 on Lionheart. The carb
has been apart a few times, now, because it had raw gas in it that
evaporated into solid shellac, plugging the jets so it wouldn't start.
This wasn't an issue with the old PREMIX 2-stroker because the oil in the
gas DIDN'T evaporate and kept the stuff left in the carbs in LIQUID form
the new gas would simply remix with and away we went. My little Yamaha 3
with the gas tank on top is like that, too. It was stored for years and
the premix still kept it from solidifying to shellac.

Changing the oil on a marina dock or sailboat STILL sucks, too....

As to the 100:1 oilers...no thanks. 50:1 is too thin to oil crankcase
bearings, no matter now much greenies and the EPA hype it. When I sold
my 1997 Mercury Sport Jet 175hp-powered Sea Rayder, all 6 cylinders were
within 5 pounds of their original compression and ran great on 40:1
PREMIX, the troublesome Mercury plastic oil injection pump and system
having been removed as soon as I found out about the 2nd recall blowing
powerheads with NO LUBRICATION. That boat's still running and the engine
had well over 1000 hours on it....on PREMIX.

Larry
--
According to EPA, all lakes that have had 2-stroke engines running in
them for the last 100 years must be 6" deep in motor oil. See it?
Oil floats, ya know!
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

Bob La Londe wrote:
> "Don White" <whited.DeleteThis@ns.sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:EBG9h.24311$cz.370466@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...
>
>>Inno wrote:
>>
>>>Mail sorters I know have this game: every day they find the parcel
>>>with the most FRAGILE stickers and play football with it...
>>>
>>
>>Too bad some supervisor couldn't catch them, show them the door and give
>>the jobs to someone who'd appreciate same.
>
>
> Wouldn't make any difference if he did. The union wouldn't let him.
>

....and who do you think gave the union absolute protection...inept
management?
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

>
> As to the 100:1 oilers...no thanks. 50:1 is too thin to oil crankcase
> bearings, no matter now much greenies and the EPA hype it. When I sold
> my 1997 Mercury Sport Jet 175hp-powered Sea Rayder, all 6 cylinders were
> within 5 pounds of their original compression and ran great on 40:1
> PREMIX, the troublesome Mercury plastic oil injection pump and system
> having been removed as soon as I found out about the 2nd recall blowing
> powerheads with NO LUBRICATION. That boat's still running and the engine
> had well over 1000 hours on it....on PREMIX.
>


I haven't seen any evidence to support this. Only outboards I've messed
with have been either 50:1 or 100:1, one of the latter is still going
strong at over 15 years old, and my V115 uses 50:1 and it still runs
great despite being almost 40 years old. Just how long do these things
have to last? Why use more oil than needed? That stuff is $$$.
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

On Sat, 25 Nov 2006 21:29:23 -0500, Larry <noone.RemoveThis@home.com> wrote:

>"Garland Gray II" <ggray.RemoveThis@nospam.com> wrote in
>news:YK59h.114$Hj4.39@newsfe17.lga:
>
>> 4 strokes are great for a lot of reasons, but if fuel quality is
>> questionable, they can be more trouble than 2 strokes. I've had fuel
>> problems with a 9.9 Yamaha 4 stroke, and an ob mechanic said water or
>> trash caused more problems w/4 strokes because of the smaller jets.
>>
>>
>
>Also, if you look back at the "good ol' days", remember when
>"winterizing" the old 2-stroker meant hauling it up the dock and putting
>it in the garage until spring? When you took it out in spring, just as
>greasy as you put it away, it wasn't all rusted up coated with oil like
>it always was. You poured PREMIX gas into it and drove away.
>
>We have a Nissan 8hp 4-stroker for a Foldabote 12 on Lionheart. The carb
>has been apart a few times, now, because it had raw gas in it that
>evaporated into solid shellac, plugging the jets so it wouldn't start.
>This wasn't an issue with the old PREMIX 2-stroker because the oil in the
>gas DIDN'T evaporate and kept the stuff left in the carbs in LIQUID form
>the new gas would simply remix with and away we went. My little Yamaha 3
>with the gas tank on top is like that, too. It was stored for years and
>the premix still kept it from solidifying to shellac.
>
>Changing the oil on a marina dock or sailboat STILL sucks, too....
>
>As to the 100:1 oilers...no thanks. 50:1 is too thin to oil crankcase
>bearings, no matter now much greenies and the EPA hype it. When I sold
>my 1997 Mercury Sport Jet 175hp-powered Sea Rayder, all 6 cylinders were
>within 5 pounds of their original compression and ran great on 40:1
>PREMIX, the troublesome Mercury plastic oil injection pump and system
>having been removed as soon as I found out about the 2nd recall blowing
>powerheads with NO LUBRICATION. That boat's still running and the engine
>had well over 1000 hours on it....on PREMIX.
>
>Larry




In the GOOD OLD DAYS gas was not 10 percent alchol and contained lead
in major quanities. Oh by the way the EPA problem with 2 strokes is
not so much the oil in the water but in the air.
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

James Sweet <jamessweet DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in news:41bah.6528$IW2.934
@trndny03:

> Why use more oil than needed?

My interest was more in protecting the engine from oil injection FAILURES
Mercury has had than in longevity. 40:1 is only 1 quart to 10 gallons, 40
gallons per gallon of oil. If you kept away from the OEM-branded oils at
awful prices and stuck to the major oil company brands, who make the OEM
oils anyways, and bought by the case...ESPECIALLY on any discounted
sales...it wasn't bad on price. I burned a couple of quarts on a weekend
buzzing around and towing the kids....

Your experience with 15 year old 2-strokers, I'm afraid, has come to an
end. They invented Ficht and Optimax and pretty much put a stop to long-
running 2-stroke motors...(c;

Oil injection can't fail if it's dumped in the gas tank to begin with....

Larry
--
Guess what I want to do with the Little Drummer Boy's drum
by Christmas Eve....rrrrump..pa-pum...pum...up his bum....
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

Linkd.DeleteThis@mindspring.com wrote in news:fufim2het1capo2e7k4p6kitgmq7vhtc3b@
4ax.com:

> Oh by the way the EPA problem with 2 strokes is
> not so much the oil in the water but in the air.

I wonder how that works?? Oil doesn't evaporate so it's not vapor
pollution. I suppose the tiny bit of smoke trailing an outboard motor is
pollution, probably .00000001% of what pours out of a single smoke stack
at your electric plant, 24/7/365.

Dead out on the river, 20 miles from the trailer, I want the simplest 2-
stroke outboard with the fewest failing parts that a guy standing in the
mud behind it along the banks can figure out what's wrong and patch it up
to get home. No valves, no belts, minimal pumps, simple carburetion,
hand startable (if necessary)....the motor with the fewest failure modes
almost anyone with any sense can get running. A 2-stroke needs:
A - Fuel
B - Spark
C - Cooling
D - Prop

Everything else is fluff.

Every one of them needs a primer bulb, a fantastic troubleshooting tool
for the fuel system and emergency fuel pump if the diaphram fails in
their pulse pump. It amazes me the number of people who just sit there
staring into it and don't THINK about what that little bulb can tell them
if they'd just pump it and think about what is happening. I've helped
lots of stranded boaters with it. "Pump the bulb for me.", I ask. "It
squeezes but doesn't come back out.", he says. "Turn on the fuel shutoff
valve.", I say...and away they go. "It pumps real easy.", he says.
"Here, let me loan you some gas.", I respond. "It pumps and I see gas in
the water behind the motor.", he says. "Your fuel pump diaphram has a
hole in it pumping gas into one cylinder, flooding it....or the carb
float is stuck. Pull the cover and we'll bypass the pump. You can
squeeze the bulb while running it home." So easy....even on a carb'd 4-
stroker.

Impossible to fix on fuel injection and other high tech nonsense....

Larry
--
Guess what I want to do with the Little Drummer Boy's drum
by Christmas Eve....rrrrump..pa-pum...pum...up his bum....
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

This message is not archived
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

Larry,
I guess that you have not noticed that:
A-Logic has little to do with environmental regulations.
B-Much of the world is trying anything they can to shut down the best
economy in the history of the world.

The old 2 strokes were dirty engines. (I did some of the testing.) Their
hydrocarbon emissions were outrageous. Anything that gets lubricated
like an old 2-stroke won't wear out any time soon, but I have been on a
could of mountain lakes that had an oil slick the likes of a tanker
spill.
For calibration, when I was working in one of those labs, the crew that
was doing the evaporative emissions testing put the office Christmas
tree into one of the evap sheds - It Didn't Pass -

Many of the world's vocal liberals are very down on the good old USofA
because we have something like 10% of the population and use 30% of the
fossil fuel. They don't happen to notice that this produces 40+% of the
worlds productivity and 15% of the worlds pollution*. (*Not including
CO2) (The quoted statistics are close but not exact.)

China has not been asked to reduce anything and they are still running
wood fired steam locomotives and have the fastest declining air quality
in the world. It is so bad that some coaches are expecting to have to
shut some of the events at the next Olympics down because of the
pollution.

Why do you think Motorcycles are now required to have catalytic
converters?

Why do liberals think that a Hybrid vehicle is a better answer than a
diesel?

Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil and not let
anybody go get what we have. (Canada has wells in most of the great
lakes - we aren't allowed to, Cuba will soon be using Chinese
investment to drill under the Florida straight - we can't do that either.)

Matt Colie - environmentally conscious but educated and realistic


Larry wrote:
> Linkd.TakeThisOut@mindspring.com wrote in news:fufim2het1capo2e7k4p6kitgmq7vhtc3b@
> 4ax.com:
>
>
>>Oh by the way the EPA problem with 2 strokes is
>>not so much the oil in the water but in the air.
>
>
> I wonder how that works?? Oil doesn't evaporate so it's not vapor
> pollution. I suppose the tiny bit of smoke trailing an outboard motor is
> pollution, probably .00000001% of what pours out of a single smoke stack
> at your electric plant, 24/7/365.
>
> Dead out on the river, 20 miles from the trailer, I want the simplest 2-
> stroke outboard with the fewest failing parts that a guy standing in the
> mud behind it along the banks can figure out what's wrong and patch it up
> to get home. No valves, no belts, minimal pumps, simple carburetion,
> hand startable (if necessary)....the motor with the fewest failure modes
> almost anyone with any sense can get running. A 2-stroke needs:
> A - Fuel
> B - Spark
> C - Cooling
> D - Prop
>
> Everything else is fluff.
>
> Every one of them needs a primer bulb, a fantastic troubleshooting tool
> for the fuel system and emergency fuel pump if the diaphram fails in
> their pulse pump. It amazes me the number of people who just sit there
> staring into it and don't THINK about what that little bulb can tell them
> if they'd just pump it and think about what is happening. I've helped
> lots of stranded boaters with it. "Pump the bulb for me.", I ask. "It
> squeezes but doesn't come back out.", he says. "Turn on the fuel shutoff
> valve.", I say...and away they go. "It pumps real easy.", he says.
> "Here, let me loan you some gas.", I respond. "It pumps and I see gas in
> the water behind the motor.", he says. "Your fuel pump diaphram has a
> hole in it pumping gas into one cylinder, flooding it....or the carb
> float is stuck. Pull the cover and we'll bypass the pump. You can
> squeeze the bulb while running it home." So easy....even on a carb'd 4-
> stroker.
>
> Impossible to fix on fuel injection and other high tech nonsense....
>
> Larry
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

"Matt Colie" <nobody.RemoveThis@netspam.net> wrote in message
news:_Omah.51$gS6.18@newsfe07.lga...
> Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil and not let anybody
> go get what we have. (Canada has wells in most of the great lakes - we
> aren't allowed to, Cuba will soon be using Chinese investment to drill
> under the Florida straight - we can't do that either.)
>
> Matt Colie - environmentally conscious but educated and realistic
>
>

I'm all for energy-independence, but I cannot believe that oil wells on our
Great Lakes would be a good idea. Oil spills from rigs on the oceans are bad
enough -- but similar spills on the Lakes would be disasterous.
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

gfretwell DeleteThis @aol.com wrote in news:5agjm251j3jcugerj8a8spgheteq5s1epj@4ax.com:

> It certainly smells bad.

I guess it was in my youth......

Every time I get a whiff of 2-stroke exhaust going by the dock, I have a
flashback to the mid 1950's. I can hear and smell that Evinrude Sportwin
7.5 as my grandfather, Jack, and I are headed back to the lake inlet to
refill Granny's freezer with more fish from that hole Gramps knows about
between two Weeping Willows along the East bank about .6 miles from its
mouth into the lake.

I also VIVIDLY remember tossing his brand new mushroom anchor into the
hole, exactly like he told me to do....without a LINE tied onto it....and
crying all the way home while he was laughing and couldn't wait to tell my
grandmother.

Nope....Two stroke exhaust, to me, is one of the sweetest smelling
fragrances on the planet.....
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

Matt Colie <nobody.TakeThisOut@netspam.net> wrote in news:_Omah.51$gS6.18@newsfe07.lga:

> Why do liberals think that a Hybrid vehicle is a better answer than a
> diesel?
>
>

Have you ever seen the documentary, "Who Killed The Electric Car?".....

The answer will astound you. It begins with D.

GM crushed every EV-1 into scrap so none could escape with evidence of how
good they really were...not for the planet...for the BUYERS.


Larry
--
Guess what I want to do with the Little Drummer Boy's drum
by Christmas Eve....rrrrump..pa-pum...pum...up his bum....
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

Matt Colie <nobody DeleteThis @netspam.net> wrote in
news:_Omah.51$gS6.18@newsfe07.lga:

> Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil and not let
> anybody go get what we have. (Canada has wells in most of the great
> lakes - we aren't allowed to, Cuba will soon be using Chinese
> investment to drill under the Florida straight - we can't do that
> either.)
>

Shhhh....don't make too much noise! 3 of my 4 vehicles are diesels. One
of them, my 6.2L Chevy stepvan, has a Frybrid in it.
(http://www.frybrid.com)

The 220D and 300TD diesel Mercedes antiques are, currently, running in
warm SC on 80% frying oil and 20% regular gas, which won't work if it
gets too cold.

3 of us pool resources and have our own veggie oil company. I have the
van (collection department), one guy has a huge warehouse (storage and
processing) and the other guy built the filtering system (settling and
filtration department). We literally have FUEL RUNNING OUT OF OUR EARS!
I was at the warehouse, yesterday, delivering another load from our
Chinese restaurants. We all filled our vehicles and still had 120
gallons ready-to-go and about 730 gallons settling out in their cans.

I don't even shut the truck down to go to breakfast. I leave the heater
running...(c;

Fuel is easy to get if you get off your asses and go after it.....and
have the right engine, not gasoline.

Larry
--
Rudolf MADE it to run on vegetable oil, ya know.

Someone asked, "Are you paying road taxes?", to try to expose me. "Yes,
I pay gas tax on every gallon of diesel and gas I buy.", I replied.
"What about the frying oil?", they retorted. "There's no road tax on
vegetable oil, yet.", I replied, smiling sheepishly...(c;

Most restaurants are PAYING a disposal company to collect and dispose of
REALLY GOOD FUEL! How stupid....
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice 

"KLC Lewis" <nospam.RemoveThis@spamless.com> wrote in
news:abCdnW-Q-qHiYPTYnZ2dnUVZ_qGdnZ2d@centurytel.net:

> I'm all for energy-independence, but I cannot believe that oil wells
> on our Great Lakes would be a good idea. Oil spills from rigs on the
> oceans are bad enough -- but similar spills on the Lakes would be
> disasterous.
>
>

Some of the finest fishing on the planet is right under those oil rigs in
the Gulf of Mexico....a whole new ecosystem that's just thriving....
all the way to the bottom!

http://www.thejump.net/fishingarticles/louisianas-steel-legged-reefs.htm
http://www.marshmission.com/coastal_correspondent/volume12.htm
http://www.gomr.mms.gov/homepg/regulate/environ/rigs-to-
reefs/information.html
.....to name a few.


Larry
--
Guess what I want to do with the Little Drummer Boy's drum
by Christmas Eve....rrrrump..pa-pum...pum...up his bum....
 >> Stay informed about: 2 stroke / 4 stroke advice